Do pilots get more fresh air than passengers?
up vote
1
down vote
favorite
There is a persistent air travel myth claiming that "pilots get more fresh air than passengers".
(source: The pure cure, p.375)
I would like experts to either dispel or confirm this myth, that pilots receive "better air" with higher oxygen levels than passengers, who have to breathe more recirculated air.
Although at first glance it might sound absurd, but when you think about it, it would actually make sense, because:
The worst thing that can happen to passengers is that they get tired. Sure, that may be unpleasant (think of the stale air in a crowded room), but does not pose a health or security risk.
Pilots, on the other hand, need to be wide awake and perform to the top of their abilities, as errors can be fatal. So any negative outside influences on pilot performance needs to be eliminated. In particular, pilot fatigue significantly increases the risk of pilot error.
However "CO2 levels directly affect pilots’ flight performance" as was tested in a study on 30 active commercial airline pilots performing maneuvers under varying carbon dioxide concentrations:
press release
Previous research led by Allen and colleagues found that, in office buildings, CO2 concentrations between 1000-2500 ppm – levels once thought to be benign – negatively impact the cognitive function of employees. For the new study, they wanted to determine if higher CO2 levels on the flight deck would impair a pilot’s ability to perform advanced maneuvers and manage emergency situations, such as a single-engine failure during takeoff. […] Average CO2 levels on the flight deck are less than 800 ppm. However, they have been measured as high as 2000 ppm on the flight deck and even higher in the cabin during the boarding process. […] The National Research Council has suggested that current standards for ventilation rates on flight decks may be inadequate.
background
On the flight deck […] the average CO2 concentrations are typically <1000 ppm, but the 95th percentile concentration can be as high as 1400 ppm, depending on airplane type.
results
Compared to segments at a CO2 concentration of 2500 ppm, the
odds of passing a maneuver as rated by the Examiner in the simulator
were 1.52 times higher when pilots were exposed to
1500 ppm and 1.69 times higher when exposed to 700 ppm.
In light of the above it would make sense to prioritize pilots over passengers when it comes to circulation of fresh air.
I will post the results of my research into this question as an answer below, but would welcome other answers presenting technical evidence and quoting citable references.
cabin-pressure oxygen bleed-air air-conditioning air-quality
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
favorite
There is a persistent air travel myth claiming that "pilots get more fresh air than passengers".
(source: The pure cure, p.375)
I would like experts to either dispel or confirm this myth, that pilots receive "better air" with higher oxygen levels than passengers, who have to breathe more recirculated air.
Although at first glance it might sound absurd, but when you think about it, it would actually make sense, because:
The worst thing that can happen to passengers is that they get tired. Sure, that may be unpleasant (think of the stale air in a crowded room), but does not pose a health or security risk.
Pilots, on the other hand, need to be wide awake and perform to the top of their abilities, as errors can be fatal. So any negative outside influences on pilot performance needs to be eliminated. In particular, pilot fatigue significantly increases the risk of pilot error.
However "CO2 levels directly affect pilots’ flight performance" as was tested in a study on 30 active commercial airline pilots performing maneuvers under varying carbon dioxide concentrations:
press release
Previous research led by Allen and colleagues found that, in office buildings, CO2 concentrations between 1000-2500 ppm – levels once thought to be benign – negatively impact the cognitive function of employees. For the new study, they wanted to determine if higher CO2 levels on the flight deck would impair a pilot’s ability to perform advanced maneuvers and manage emergency situations, such as a single-engine failure during takeoff. […] Average CO2 levels on the flight deck are less than 800 ppm. However, they have been measured as high as 2000 ppm on the flight deck and even higher in the cabin during the boarding process. […] The National Research Council has suggested that current standards for ventilation rates on flight decks may be inadequate.
background
On the flight deck […] the average CO2 concentrations are typically <1000 ppm, but the 95th percentile concentration can be as high as 1400 ppm, depending on airplane type.
results
Compared to segments at a CO2 concentration of 2500 ppm, the
odds of passing a maneuver as rated by the Examiner in the simulator
were 1.52 times higher when pilots were exposed to
1500 ppm and 1.69 times higher when exposed to 700 ppm.
In light of the above it would make sense to prioritize pilots over passengers when it comes to circulation of fresh air.
I will post the results of my research into this question as an answer below, but would welcome other answers presenting technical evidence and quoting citable references.
cabin-pressure oxygen bleed-air air-conditioning air-quality
1
Related: Do pilots breathe the same air as passengers?(
– Dan Pichelman
6 hours ago
1
The statement that pilots can get 10x more oxygen than pax, on its own, does not make sense. A 10x difference would either mean the pilots are breathing 100% $O_2$, which is just not necessary, or the passengers are beginning to die. The only extenuating case where it might be true is during an emergency descent where the oxygen masks have dropped, and only long enough to get down to 10,000 ft.
– abelenky
4 hours ago
@abelenky: You are talking about a 10x higher oxygen concentration in the air. I don't think this is the claim, but rather 10x higher airflow (and thus oxygen flow) per person, e.g. 10 CFMP (ft³/min per person) in the cabin and 100 CFMP in the cockpit.
– summerrain
4 hours ago
Note in particular that while this has an alleged endnote citation, Ms. Fairechild is not actually quoted but paraphrased.
– chrylis
2 hours ago
@summerrain If that's what they meant to claim, then saying "ten times more oxygen" is a really strange way to say it. I was thinking the same thing as abelensky when I read that.
– reirab
2 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
1
down vote
favorite
up vote
1
down vote
favorite
There is a persistent air travel myth claiming that "pilots get more fresh air than passengers".
(source: The pure cure, p.375)
I would like experts to either dispel or confirm this myth, that pilots receive "better air" with higher oxygen levels than passengers, who have to breathe more recirculated air.
Although at first glance it might sound absurd, but when you think about it, it would actually make sense, because:
The worst thing that can happen to passengers is that they get tired. Sure, that may be unpleasant (think of the stale air in a crowded room), but does not pose a health or security risk.
Pilots, on the other hand, need to be wide awake and perform to the top of their abilities, as errors can be fatal. So any negative outside influences on pilot performance needs to be eliminated. In particular, pilot fatigue significantly increases the risk of pilot error.
However "CO2 levels directly affect pilots’ flight performance" as was tested in a study on 30 active commercial airline pilots performing maneuvers under varying carbon dioxide concentrations:
press release
Previous research led by Allen and colleagues found that, in office buildings, CO2 concentrations between 1000-2500 ppm – levels once thought to be benign – negatively impact the cognitive function of employees. For the new study, they wanted to determine if higher CO2 levels on the flight deck would impair a pilot’s ability to perform advanced maneuvers and manage emergency situations, such as a single-engine failure during takeoff. […] Average CO2 levels on the flight deck are less than 800 ppm. However, they have been measured as high as 2000 ppm on the flight deck and even higher in the cabin during the boarding process. […] The National Research Council has suggested that current standards for ventilation rates on flight decks may be inadequate.
background
On the flight deck […] the average CO2 concentrations are typically <1000 ppm, but the 95th percentile concentration can be as high as 1400 ppm, depending on airplane type.
results
Compared to segments at a CO2 concentration of 2500 ppm, the
odds of passing a maneuver as rated by the Examiner in the simulator
were 1.52 times higher when pilots were exposed to
1500 ppm and 1.69 times higher when exposed to 700 ppm.
In light of the above it would make sense to prioritize pilots over passengers when it comes to circulation of fresh air.
I will post the results of my research into this question as an answer below, but would welcome other answers presenting technical evidence and quoting citable references.
cabin-pressure oxygen bleed-air air-conditioning air-quality
There is a persistent air travel myth claiming that "pilots get more fresh air than passengers".
(source: The pure cure, p.375)
I would like experts to either dispel or confirm this myth, that pilots receive "better air" with higher oxygen levels than passengers, who have to breathe more recirculated air.
Although at first glance it might sound absurd, but when you think about it, it would actually make sense, because:
The worst thing that can happen to passengers is that they get tired. Sure, that may be unpleasant (think of the stale air in a crowded room), but does not pose a health or security risk.
Pilots, on the other hand, need to be wide awake and perform to the top of their abilities, as errors can be fatal. So any negative outside influences on pilot performance needs to be eliminated. In particular, pilot fatigue significantly increases the risk of pilot error.
However "CO2 levels directly affect pilots’ flight performance" as was tested in a study on 30 active commercial airline pilots performing maneuvers under varying carbon dioxide concentrations:
press release
Previous research led by Allen and colleagues found that, in office buildings, CO2 concentrations between 1000-2500 ppm – levels once thought to be benign – negatively impact the cognitive function of employees. For the new study, they wanted to determine if higher CO2 levels on the flight deck would impair a pilot’s ability to perform advanced maneuvers and manage emergency situations, such as a single-engine failure during takeoff. […] Average CO2 levels on the flight deck are less than 800 ppm. However, they have been measured as high as 2000 ppm on the flight deck and even higher in the cabin during the boarding process. […] The National Research Council has suggested that current standards for ventilation rates on flight decks may be inadequate.
background
On the flight deck […] the average CO2 concentrations are typically <1000 ppm, but the 95th percentile concentration can be as high as 1400 ppm, depending on airplane type.
results
Compared to segments at a CO2 concentration of 2500 ppm, the
odds of passing a maneuver as rated by the Examiner in the simulator
were 1.52 times higher when pilots were exposed to
1500 ppm and 1.69 times higher when exposed to 700 ppm.
In light of the above it would make sense to prioritize pilots over passengers when it comes to circulation of fresh air.
I will post the results of my research into this question as an answer below, but would welcome other answers presenting technical evidence and quoting citable references.
cabin-pressure oxygen bleed-air air-conditioning air-quality
cabin-pressure oxygen bleed-air air-conditioning air-quality
asked 7 hours ago
summerrain
748517
748517
1
Related: Do pilots breathe the same air as passengers?(
– Dan Pichelman
6 hours ago
1
The statement that pilots can get 10x more oxygen than pax, on its own, does not make sense. A 10x difference would either mean the pilots are breathing 100% $O_2$, which is just not necessary, or the passengers are beginning to die. The only extenuating case where it might be true is during an emergency descent where the oxygen masks have dropped, and only long enough to get down to 10,000 ft.
– abelenky
4 hours ago
@abelenky: You are talking about a 10x higher oxygen concentration in the air. I don't think this is the claim, but rather 10x higher airflow (and thus oxygen flow) per person, e.g. 10 CFMP (ft³/min per person) in the cabin and 100 CFMP in the cockpit.
– summerrain
4 hours ago
Note in particular that while this has an alleged endnote citation, Ms. Fairechild is not actually quoted but paraphrased.
– chrylis
2 hours ago
@summerrain If that's what they meant to claim, then saying "ten times more oxygen" is a really strange way to say it. I was thinking the same thing as abelensky when I read that.
– reirab
2 hours ago
add a comment |
1
Related: Do pilots breathe the same air as passengers?(
– Dan Pichelman
6 hours ago
1
The statement that pilots can get 10x more oxygen than pax, on its own, does not make sense. A 10x difference would either mean the pilots are breathing 100% $O_2$, which is just not necessary, or the passengers are beginning to die. The only extenuating case where it might be true is during an emergency descent where the oxygen masks have dropped, and only long enough to get down to 10,000 ft.
– abelenky
4 hours ago
@abelenky: You are talking about a 10x higher oxygen concentration in the air. I don't think this is the claim, but rather 10x higher airflow (and thus oxygen flow) per person, e.g. 10 CFMP (ft³/min per person) in the cabin and 100 CFMP in the cockpit.
– summerrain
4 hours ago
Note in particular that while this has an alleged endnote citation, Ms. Fairechild is not actually quoted but paraphrased.
– chrylis
2 hours ago
@summerrain If that's what they meant to claim, then saying "ten times more oxygen" is a really strange way to say it. I was thinking the same thing as abelensky when I read that.
– reirab
2 hours ago
1
1
Related: Do pilots breathe the same air as passengers?(
– Dan Pichelman
6 hours ago
Related: Do pilots breathe the same air as passengers?(
– Dan Pichelman
6 hours ago
1
1
The statement that pilots can get 10x more oxygen than pax, on its own, does not make sense. A 10x difference would either mean the pilots are breathing 100% $O_2$, which is just not necessary, or the passengers are beginning to die. The only extenuating case where it might be true is during an emergency descent where the oxygen masks have dropped, and only long enough to get down to 10,000 ft.
– abelenky
4 hours ago
The statement that pilots can get 10x more oxygen than pax, on its own, does not make sense. A 10x difference would either mean the pilots are breathing 100% $O_2$, which is just not necessary, or the passengers are beginning to die. The only extenuating case where it might be true is during an emergency descent where the oxygen masks have dropped, and only long enough to get down to 10,000 ft.
– abelenky
4 hours ago
@abelenky: You are talking about a 10x higher oxygen concentration in the air. I don't think this is the claim, but rather 10x higher airflow (and thus oxygen flow) per person, e.g. 10 CFMP (ft³/min per person) in the cabin and 100 CFMP in the cockpit.
– summerrain
4 hours ago
@abelenky: You are talking about a 10x higher oxygen concentration in the air. I don't think this is the claim, but rather 10x higher airflow (and thus oxygen flow) per person, e.g. 10 CFMP (ft³/min per person) in the cabin and 100 CFMP in the cockpit.
– summerrain
4 hours ago
Note in particular that while this has an alleged endnote citation, Ms. Fairechild is not actually quoted but paraphrased.
– chrylis
2 hours ago
Note in particular that while this has an alleged endnote citation, Ms. Fairechild is not actually quoted but paraphrased.
– chrylis
2 hours ago
@summerrain If that's what they meant to claim, then saying "ten times more oxygen" is a really strange way to say it. I was thinking the same thing as abelensky when I read that.
– reirab
2 hours ago
@summerrain If that's what they meant to claim, then saying "ten times more oxygen" is a really strange way to say it. I was thinking the same thing as abelensky when I read that.
– reirab
2 hours ago
add a comment |
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
up vote
4
down vote
Taking the B737 as an example, conditioned air from the left pack flows directly into the cockpit (green arrows), whereas the passenger cabin is served from the mix manifold only (yellow arrows), meaning that pilots indeed receive more fresh air and less re-circulated air than passengers. Depending on aircraft type, on average about 50% of the ventilation air is recirculated cabinair (red arrows):
A portion of the conditioned air from the left pack flows directly into the flight deck. (source)
(added annotation)
This is confirmed by AFA-CWA flight attendants association:
- How much air is supplied in the economy section? 6-10 ft³/min of outside air to each person which is about half what is recommended in
buildings and transportation vehicles.
- The cockpit gets 50-100 ft³/min per person of outside air, or sometimes a mix of outside and recirculated air depending on the
aircraft type. That is up to 20 times more than in the passenger
cabin.
1
It's actually a minority of the left pack air going to the flight deck; maybe a third of so. The bulk of it is going to the cabin to supplement the right pack, being the less restrictive path. Not to say the air quality still isn't better up front.
– John K
6 hours ago
In other words 33% of the fresh air from the left pack is for 2 persons only.
– summerrain
4 hours ago
@summerrain the two people are V.I.P.s...
– Harper
2 hours ago
add a comment |
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
1 Answer
1
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
active
oldest
votes
up vote
4
down vote
Taking the B737 as an example, conditioned air from the left pack flows directly into the cockpit (green arrows), whereas the passenger cabin is served from the mix manifold only (yellow arrows), meaning that pilots indeed receive more fresh air and less re-circulated air than passengers. Depending on aircraft type, on average about 50% of the ventilation air is recirculated cabinair (red arrows):
A portion of the conditioned air from the left pack flows directly into the flight deck. (source)
(added annotation)
This is confirmed by AFA-CWA flight attendants association:
- How much air is supplied in the economy section? 6-10 ft³/min of outside air to each person which is about half what is recommended in
buildings and transportation vehicles.
- The cockpit gets 50-100 ft³/min per person of outside air, or sometimes a mix of outside and recirculated air depending on the
aircraft type. That is up to 20 times more than in the passenger
cabin.
1
It's actually a minority of the left pack air going to the flight deck; maybe a third of so. The bulk of it is going to the cabin to supplement the right pack, being the less restrictive path. Not to say the air quality still isn't better up front.
– John K
6 hours ago
In other words 33% of the fresh air from the left pack is for 2 persons only.
– summerrain
4 hours ago
@summerrain the two people are V.I.P.s...
– Harper
2 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
Taking the B737 as an example, conditioned air from the left pack flows directly into the cockpit (green arrows), whereas the passenger cabin is served from the mix manifold only (yellow arrows), meaning that pilots indeed receive more fresh air and less re-circulated air than passengers. Depending on aircraft type, on average about 50% of the ventilation air is recirculated cabinair (red arrows):
A portion of the conditioned air from the left pack flows directly into the flight deck. (source)
(added annotation)
This is confirmed by AFA-CWA flight attendants association:
- How much air is supplied in the economy section? 6-10 ft³/min of outside air to each person which is about half what is recommended in
buildings and transportation vehicles.
- The cockpit gets 50-100 ft³/min per person of outside air, or sometimes a mix of outside and recirculated air depending on the
aircraft type. That is up to 20 times more than in the passenger
cabin.
1
It's actually a minority of the left pack air going to the flight deck; maybe a third of so. The bulk of it is going to the cabin to supplement the right pack, being the less restrictive path. Not to say the air quality still isn't better up front.
– John K
6 hours ago
In other words 33% of the fresh air from the left pack is for 2 persons only.
– summerrain
4 hours ago
@summerrain the two people are V.I.P.s...
– Harper
2 hours ago
add a comment |
up vote
4
down vote
up vote
4
down vote
Taking the B737 as an example, conditioned air from the left pack flows directly into the cockpit (green arrows), whereas the passenger cabin is served from the mix manifold only (yellow arrows), meaning that pilots indeed receive more fresh air and less re-circulated air than passengers. Depending on aircraft type, on average about 50% of the ventilation air is recirculated cabinair (red arrows):
A portion of the conditioned air from the left pack flows directly into the flight deck. (source)
(added annotation)
This is confirmed by AFA-CWA flight attendants association:
- How much air is supplied in the economy section? 6-10 ft³/min of outside air to each person which is about half what is recommended in
buildings and transportation vehicles.
- The cockpit gets 50-100 ft³/min per person of outside air, or sometimes a mix of outside and recirculated air depending on the
aircraft type. That is up to 20 times more than in the passenger
cabin.
Taking the B737 as an example, conditioned air from the left pack flows directly into the cockpit (green arrows), whereas the passenger cabin is served from the mix manifold only (yellow arrows), meaning that pilots indeed receive more fresh air and less re-circulated air than passengers. Depending on aircraft type, on average about 50% of the ventilation air is recirculated cabinair (red arrows):
A portion of the conditioned air from the left pack flows directly into the flight deck. (source)
(added annotation)
This is confirmed by AFA-CWA flight attendants association:
- How much air is supplied in the economy section? 6-10 ft³/min of outside air to each person which is about half what is recommended in
buildings and transportation vehicles.
- The cockpit gets 50-100 ft³/min per person of outside air, or sometimes a mix of outside and recirculated air depending on the
aircraft type. That is up to 20 times more than in the passenger
cabin.
edited 3 hours ago
answered 7 hours ago
summerrain
748517
748517
1
It's actually a minority of the left pack air going to the flight deck; maybe a third of so. The bulk of it is going to the cabin to supplement the right pack, being the less restrictive path. Not to say the air quality still isn't better up front.
– John K
6 hours ago
In other words 33% of the fresh air from the left pack is for 2 persons only.
– summerrain
4 hours ago
@summerrain the two people are V.I.P.s...
– Harper
2 hours ago
add a comment |
1
It's actually a minority of the left pack air going to the flight deck; maybe a third of so. The bulk of it is going to the cabin to supplement the right pack, being the less restrictive path. Not to say the air quality still isn't better up front.
– John K
6 hours ago
In other words 33% of the fresh air from the left pack is for 2 persons only.
– summerrain
4 hours ago
@summerrain the two people are V.I.P.s...
– Harper
2 hours ago
1
1
It's actually a minority of the left pack air going to the flight deck; maybe a third of so. The bulk of it is going to the cabin to supplement the right pack, being the less restrictive path. Not to say the air quality still isn't better up front.
– John K
6 hours ago
It's actually a minority of the left pack air going to the flight deck; maybe a third of so. The bulk of it is going to the cabin to supplement the right pack, being the less restrictive path. Not to say the air quality still isn't better up front.
– John K
6 hours ago
In other words 33% of the fresh air from the left pack is for 2 persons only.
– summerrain
4 hours ago
In other words 33% of the fresh air from the left pack is for 2 persons only.
– summerrain
4 hours ago
@summerrain the two people are V.I.P.s...
– Harper
2 hours ago
@summerrain the two people are V.I.P.s...
– Harper
2 hours ago
add a comment |
Thanks for contributing an answer to Aviation Stack Exchange!
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
Use MathJax to format equations. MathJax reference.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Some of your past answers have not been well-received, and you're in danger of being blocked from answering.
Please pay close attention to the following guidance:
- Please be sure to answer the question. Provide details and share your research!
But avoid …
- Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers.
- Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience.
To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers.
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
StackExchange.ready(
function () {
StackExchange.openid.initPostLogin('.new-post-login', 'https%3a%2f%2faviation.stackexchange.com%2fquestions%2f57960%2fdo-pilots-get-more-fresh-air-than-passengers%23new-answer', 'question_page');
}
);
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Sign up or log in
StackExchange.ready(function () {
StackExchange.helpers.onClickDraftSave('#login-link');
});
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Sign up using Google
Sign up using Facebook
Sign up using Email and Password
Post as a guest
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
Required, but never shown
1
Related: Do pilots breathe the same air as passengers?(
– Dan Pichelman
6 hours ago
1
The statement that pilots can get 10x more oxygen than pax, on its own, does not make sense. A 10x difference would either mean the pilots are breathing 100% $O_2$, which is just not necessary, or the passengers are beginning to die. The only extenuating case where it might be true is during an emergency descent where the oxygen masks have dropped, and only long enough to get down to 10,000 ft.
– abelenky
4 hours ago
@abelenky: You are talking about a 10x higher oxygen concentration in the air. I don't think this is the claim, but rather 10x higher airflow (and thus oxygen flow) per person, e.g. 10 CFMP (ft³/min per person) in the cabin and 100 CFMP in the cockpit.
– summerrain
4 hours ago
Note in particular that while this has an alleged endnote citation, Ms. Fairechild is not actually quoted but paraphrased.
– chrylis
2 hours ago
@summerrain If that's what they meant to claim, then saying "ten times more oxygen" is a really strange way to say it. I was thinking the same thing as abelensky when I read that.
– reirab
2 hours ago